Interview with Daisy Lin Shapiro

September 30, 2003
Interviewed by Angie KangM
Transcribed by Jennifer Chong

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Daisy Lin Shapiro's latest documentary, "Looking for YLLOGRL," is an unflinching portrait of Asian American women whose identities are shaped and united through ethnic solidarity. Shapiro's own career includes extensive journalistic experience, as well as various producing, writing, and directing credits. "Beating the Odds" and "Unsung Heroes" are two NBC 4 programs depicting community struggles and triumphs, and have garnered her both public and critical acclaim. She has also worked on countless specials, including the Asian American Heritage Month, African American Heritage Month, the L.A. Riots, and Margaret Cho. In the process, she has been awarded Golden Mike Awards three times and Greater LA Press Club Awards in '97 and '01; she has been up for Emmy nominations in 1996, 2001, and 2002. Currently, she resides in Los Angeles, where she concentrates her efforts to promote "Looking for YLLOGRL."

Angie: Could you please introduce yourself and just tell us a little about your background.

Daisy: Sure. My name is Daisy Lin Shapiro. I am a journalist and I was a Bruin. Yeah, go Bruins! I was born in Taiwan and immigrated with my parents here when I was nine years old, settled in the San Gabriel Valley, and attended UCLA and I still live here in LA on the Westside.

Angie: In your earlier career as a journalist, you produced such works as "Unsung Heroes" and "Beating the Odds" on NBC, basically just kind of documenting every day people making a difference in life. What inspired you to work on these kinds of projects?

Daisy: Well, it's not my former career; I am still a working journalist so I don't want people at work to think I've quit or something. No, I still work at channel 4, NBC 4, and I still produce a series called "Beating the Odds." I've always been fascinated by stories about the ordinary person, you know, not someone who's out there shooting at people or OJ. I've always been interested in the stories that not everyone else was going after. You know, you've got 15 media outlets covering OJ selling his house, which I had to cover. I've covered the floods, the riots, all sorts of different things. But what I always found fascinating were these gems, these stories about ordinary people that you don't normally hear; What I've always been interested in is the human side in all of us especially in a big city like LA where people don't really leave their town or leave the Westside or Orange County. I just thought it was really important to do these stories that introduced people to other people in Watts or in Bell Gardens, on the Westside, all around, people you wouldn't normally meet. In that way, I felt like it would bring the community together so that we can all see each other like regular people, you know, like normal people and that's also what I'm trying to do with this film, in a way. So I've always gravitated towards those types of projects.

Angie: So since you started, what kind of impact have you seen with "Beating the Odds" and "Unsung Heroes"? What kind of impact have these kinds of programs made in society so far as you could tell?

Daisy: Well, I've been doing "Beating the Odds" for eight years, so just with the students that we profile itself, I've seen a difference. We've profiled students. "Beating the Odds" is a series about students who have overcome a lot of obstacles in their lives and just things that happen to them through no fault of their own, like family problems. The girl that I most recently just profiled, her father was a manic-depressive. They lived in Watts. He basically lost it one day and shot her mother, her sister, and her, and then killed himself. This was an item that the news covered as a regular news story. "Oh, it's terrible, murder suicide in South La," and that was the end of the story. But, without "Beating the Odds," we wouldn't have known the real story of this girl and her sister. Even though she was shot four times in the back by her own father, she is now an honor student; she is now going onto college, and also her sister has gone on to college. We have a lot of these stories where four years ago, we interviewed these students who were just graduating from high school, and four years later, thanks to the help of the money that we've raised for them, they've managed to get through college and now they're graduating from college. So, we've seen a number of stories like that where it's made a difference in their lives. But also, since I've been doing this series for so long and "Unsung Heroes," whenever I go out there, I do hear people all the time say, "Oh yeah, I saw that story about the girl who worked as a clown on the weekends because she had no money, and I just, oh man, it just made me cry, and it just made me relate to this young girl who is an immigrant from El Salvador." So people you normally would walk down the street with, you would never talk to them, but because you saw this piece, it made an impact on you. And what I love to hear is when people remember the pieces because that tells me that it's making people notice the humanity in other people that they wouldn't normally talk to or meet.

Angie: Well, you're obviously very passionate about documenting the lives of these everyday people. How did you use these experiences to kind of propel you into "Looking for YLLOGRL," or was it completely separate? Did you just get the idea and was inspired by some people?

Daisy: Well, yeah, I think in working in media for so long... I graduated from UCLA in 1991 and did all sorts of internships and I've worked in various stations in town, interned at national TV stations and that sort of thing. So I'm doing all these stories about all these other people, and it did occur to me, "Wow, there aren't very many Asians on television, and gosh, what can I do to help? How can I contribute with the skills that I have?" But it wasn't even that that one day I said I'm going to do an Asian American documentary; it didn't come that way. It came because I was in charge of producing stories for Asian American Heritage month at channel 4 and I sent out an email to some of my friends and I said, "Hey do you have any story ideas, let me know," and then I got all these ideas including a few emails from a couple of really interesting women who were talking about the things that they were doing. One of them was a stand up comedian who's an ABC (American Born), and she does this stand up character where she dresses up in a traditional Korean dress and she goes up on stage as this character...this FOB, this F.O.B., and she starts telling these crazy, racists, different types of jokes. It's her way of examining racism. And there was another woman who does this character called "Miss Chinatown 2nd runner up," and she is nothing like a Miss Chinatown. She's got this terrible make-up; she's got this cigar and a whiskey bottle. And these women were really just like putting themselves out there and talking about these ideals about beauty and race in such an open way and it really inspired me. The first thing I said was, "Wow, I want to meet these women. Who are they?" I grew up in a household that was very kind of conservative and like "don't rock the boat," "be careful what you say, don't do anything that would embarrass yourself or the family" and that sort of thing. And here were these women doing these outrageous things and talking about things that I always sort of thought about but never went and started talking to people about. Like, isn't it messed up how we have to grow up with these ideals of being this perfect Miss Chinatown with so much poise, and you know just the right thing to say in Chinese, and you're beautiful, and nothing is wrong. What I liked about these women was that they talked about things. They got the dialogue going and that's just the kind of dialogue I want to have because I really haven't heard enough dialogue especially in media. So that's when I said, well maybe what I can do is I can make the film that would have people talking and that's what the film is about. The film is not about promoting Asians as super people or perfect people. It's just to bring up these issues that come up when you're raised like we are with these immigrants. A lot of times in these immigrant families, they have a different set of values than the ones we've grown up with as Americans. What does that bring up and what does that say about what it means to be an American and how sometimes its so funny and how sometimes it's so frustrating. So what we want to do is show Asian Americans as real people and not like "look at these superwomen they're great." People already think Asians are so smart and so hardworking and that's not necessarily a bad rep., but its just another way for it to turn and become like "wow they're almost not human because they are so perfect." I'm not here to make a film about perfect Asian Americans and super people, just Asians as real people and just get more images out there of Asian Americans because there is such a limited set of images out there.

Angie: So through this documentary, you kind of wanted to touch on the issues that affect Asians today and kind of portray Asians in many lights right? So then, why did you choose to just focus on women because presumably these issues affect men also.

Daisy: Well, it's just a personal project. It's what personally touches me and I also think it's very interesting, the kind of the of hyper feminine image that Asian American women have in particular and that's something that has particular interest for me. So, this is not the definitive look at Asian American life for me. This is where I come from and what I'm trying to examine, and that's why it's focused towards women. I mean the reason that in large part that I really feel strongly that I should be making this film is because I grew up in Taiwan. I knew my grandmother. Now, some of the other young people of later generations, I don't know about you guys. Your generation may not necessarily have had that foot in the old world. So having that connection to my grandmother and being a history student at UCLA and realizing where we are today, this particular time, and this particular place, and the fact that I have this opportunity to make a film, to go out and make a film and ask these questions, is because I'm an Asian American woman. We also do talk to Asian American men in the film, but for me, what kicked it off were these Asian American women who wrote to me. I would love to do also...you know, some people have suggested, well maybe you should do a "Yellow Boys" thing after this, and, maybe. It's not that I'm not interested. It's just that there is so much to cover. There's no way that I can also cover Asian American female and men in the same documentary. So, it's already such a big topic just with Asian American women. I figured that I can, through the eyes of Asian American women, address a lot of different issues, ones that also concern Asian American men and just ones that concern what it means to be an American on a bigger scale and all women. At a certain point, you just have to focus in. And then of course, when I heard about this women who was driving this yellow car with the license plate "YLLOGRL," that just help propel the project in terms of the narrative structure...you know, the what is the "yellow girl," let's find out, let's find her.

Angie: Yeah, when I was reading about the story I thought that was just such a brilliant idea just to follow the mystery woman in the yellow taxi. Do you think that it's even relevant if you find the lady at the end because I feel like it's more the journey that you're meaning to focus on and the end really doesn't really matter. So is that where the significance of the title comes in?

Daisy: Right. Well that's very...I think that's very smart of you to pick that up. It is the journey because at first, in the beginning, we didn't even have this women. I mean, it wasn't like my idea for her to appear. At first, I just wanted to do something on Asian American women, a new generation and a new attitude. I came up with this temporary title which was "Yellow GRRRLS U.S.A." because I wanted to really put out there that this was a new generation, that this was a break from the old. Of course, it rests on the shoulders of the generations before us. It didn't happen in isolation, but I wanted to convey a certain sort of attitude and catch people's attention and it did. But then, that's when people started calling me, and my editor, who is not Asian, but he called me and said "Daisy, I'm driving on the freeway and there's a car in front of me and the license plate says "YLLOGRL." And I started getting other people saying "Yeah, there's this car with YLLOGRL." So, it's kind of like, "if you name it, they will come" type of thing. It just really kind of confirmed for me that that yes, there's something happening here with a generation...a new generation. There is a certain attitude that's emerging. That's how that whole thing came about. It wasn't even that I started off with her. So, it was kind of like a gift, like "Oh, here you go, YLLOGRL." But, at first we were saying "Well, God, we got to find her." And then people were like "Well, what if you don't find her, what's gonna happen?" And we just decided, " Yeah, it is the search for her. It is the journey that is the meat of the documentary and you don't have to find her." However, she found me, so we have found her. But the documentary is not the "yellow girl" documentary. It's all the yellow girls out there. There are even people that wouldn't call themselves "Yellow Girl." Not everyone in this film agrees and that's I think, an important part of the film. It's not like all Asians agree with each other that a girl who calls herself a "Yellow Girl" is necessarily doing a good thing or that they like that; some people don't like it.

Angie: After going through the journey yourself of making this film and everything, have you come to a conclusion yourself of what it means to be a "Yellow Girl" or do you think that it's more individual. I mean you could take it to be whatever you want it to be.

Daisy: Right. Well, I'm tempted to just say go see the film and you'll find out because you will reach that conclusion. At the very end of the film, we will meet her, but this is after having met all of these women. But, yes, I will say that there is no definitive answer to what is a "Yellow Girl." Just in my meeting so many women - and not even the women in the film, just women that I've had conversations with just because I'm making this film - and people want to talk to me about their experience, and men too. It's not just women that are in this film. A "yellow girl" is whoever you want her to be, whoever you want to be. What I've learned personally from this film is that I can be whoever I want to be and I can say whatever I think and it's okay; you may not agree with me but I have a right to say it and we can have a dialogue about it. Categories really don't mean anything and we don't have to be bound by these labels of "Asian girl" or "UCLA student." You're so much more than the sum of these parts. And what this film, what we want to do with this film, is to have other people see that and say, "Oh, okay. I've never heard an Asian person say that or I've never seen an Asian person do that. This is not what I thought...this is different than what I've seen on TV. I better re-evaluate the images I have in my head about Asian people, Asian women." So, this film is out to show Asian Americans not as the model minorities, not as the Geisha girl, but as a human. I mean, it doesn't necessarily mean that there aren't times when you'll find a woman who is like a "Dragon Lady," or that you won't find some Asian women who are prostitutes or something. It's not that they don't exist. It's just that there's a lot more than just them than what you see on TV. So, that's what we're trying to do with the film.

Angie: And I see so much of your journalistic experience kind of shining out of all that you said because it's almost as if you're exploring humanity through "Beating the Odds" as well as this film and it kind of seems to be like the underlying theme in a lot of things you tackle. Do you have future plans of anything else besides "Looking for YLLOGRL," or is it screening soon, or when will it be released?

Daisy: Well, I am focused on finishing this film right now and the fundraiser that we had was really successful. A lot of groups came together to help make that happen and that was really great to see. We've gotten inquiries from other universities out of state which was very gratifying to me because it just seemed like there was such a need out there, that there was a shortage of this type of material. I even remember seeing in a magazine article that people were discussing in their Asian American studies classes. They were discussing the one Asian woman that was on "The Bachelor" or something. That was the topic of conversation. I was like, "Oh my god, they're really starving for material here, let's get them more stories out there." We're talking about "The Bachelorette," my goodness. So, what we're going to do is, you know, we all have day jobs and that's helping to fuel this project as all of our personal passions. So, we're hoping to get this done...finish shooting this winter and then start editing in the spring and have it finished in late spring or maybe early summer. As soon as we can, we'll get it out there because there's already a demand for them. People are asking for it. After that, we'll take it to the festivals and see where it goes with that. As to what's after this, there are a couple of stories that I've been working on that involve Asian characters. Perhaps I would like to take a foray into fictional filmmaking. Or, another project that would really interest me too is something about the environment because that's very important to me and I really think that we're destroying our natural resources. I think something can be done about that too. So, you know, just stories I'm interested in, just things that I think are important. I just feel that if you follow your heart in what you're interested in, it'll take you to the right place. So, I don't know exactly where this is going to take me but that's part of the journey, just like I didn't know whether I would find the "YLLOGRL" or what would even come of this project. I just feel that if you stick with what moves you then you're going in the right direction.

Angie: Well, thank you very much.

Daisy: My pleasure.